This week, Alex is joined by former State Senator and Maine State Treasurer Terry Hayes. The two discuss Terry's transitions from public school teacher to politics to her current roll as Executive Director of the Maine Municipal Bond Bank.
Podcast Transcript:
AS 00:06
Thank you so much for joining us for this episode of Serra Speaks. We are joined by Terry Hayes today, the executive director of the Maine Municipal Bond Bank, and a very well known figure in Maine. Terry, thank you so much for joining us.
TH 00:20
I very much appreciate the invitation.
AS 00:23
So no one really grows up to say I want to be the executive director of the Maine Municipal Bond Bank. So what is it that you did earlier in your life that has led you to this role? You're well known figure, former candidate for governor, been around Augusta politics a ton. How did you get to where you are now?
TH 00:47
Well, it wasn't a straight line, which is kind of fascinating. When I want to say maybe now, five years ago, I had to sit down and do a timeline because the group of university women had asked me to come and speak with them. And I said, What would you like me to talk about? And they said that we want you to talk about you. That's the first time anyone ever asked me to talk about me. And I couldn't imagine how they would be interested. I thought, well, it doesn't seem like I should be. And I've learned some things that were fascinating. And when I look at where I am now, there are things in my past that might have suggested that this would be a place I would end up but it was not something that I ruminated on or shot for. In fact, it I hadn't considered it until learning that Mike had retired. And I said, oh, my goodness, what an opportunity that would be and I had never thought about it.
AS 01:41
And that was Mike?
TH 01:42
Mike Goodwin. Mike and I were colleagues and the bond bank provides financial services to other organizations. Some of them local governments, and parts of the state government and so forth. So I stayed state treasurer for four years. And in that capacity, I was on all three boards that the bond bank answers to, programming wise, there are three different boards. So I spent time there, I understood the programs, at least at a board level. And, and Mike taught me a lot of what I know about moral obligation bonds, and that area of public finance, as did my board experience. But when I think back, and I when I put this stuff in a timeline, when I was in college, I ended up chairing the Student Activities fee. Everybody paid like, you know, 75 bucks a year, and it went to this big pile of money and there were four or five of us that got to decide what we, what what to spend it on. You know, I can't figure out how I have, I don't remember, but I ended up doing that. And that was probably the first opportunity. And then when I stop and think about it, the number of times that I ended up tracking the money, you know, whether it's in my personal finances or some group, you know, that I joined or whatever. So when I step back and look at it, I think, well, I shouldn't be surprised. Look at that, you know.
AS 03:15
There was a theme. There was a theme and a common thread it sounds like.
TH 03:18
There was. And my experience in the State Treasury role is really why I was interested in the bond bank, I really understood what it did. And you know, I can say if you are in Maine, and you are driving on a paved road, you cross a bridge, ou drive by any public infrastructure that meaning the, you know, the water company, the clean water or water treatment plant, a public hospital, or a private hospital, Institute of Higher Education, any of the recent within the last 15 years improvements within the court system, in the state, all of these things, you're a part owner if you're a remainer, because we've helped finance them. And we financed them through selling bonds, raising capital and then allowing the borrower... it could be the water company or the town, or the judicial branch to pay those off over time. And so the investors, the people who buy the bond, make money, the public improvements get created. And, and we all benefit from that. So we're making a difference across means communities.
AS 04:37
That's exciting. That must be meaningful.
TH 04:40
It's part of what really attracted me to the organization because when you understand how broad the impact is, and because in Maine so many of our municipalities are small, they don't have a lot of necessarily financial expertise. They still need a sand and salt shed, they still need to raise money for summer roads. So we provide the expertise and the credit rating so that they don't have to. We also manage for the state, several different bond programs. The treasurer's office does all the general obligation bonds. Those are bonds that Mainers vote on. If it's on the ballot, it's a general obligation bond. But I mentioned the court facilities, the government facilities authority is one of the boards that I'm responsible to for. And that's the mechanism we use to fund the courthouse improvements. Anybody who's here in Augusta that drives by the new judicial center that was funded through the bonds that the bond bank manages for the government facilities authority.
AS 05:58
Tell me a little bit about your life growing up. Tell me a snippet, give us some insight into how Terry Hayes became Terry Hayes.
TH 06:07
I am number two of six children born in seven years. My my mother converted to Catholicism to marry my dad, and they lived the dream. I'm born on my sister's first birthday.
AS 06:26
Born where?
TH 06:27
In Portland. I'm a native. Yep. And so we are five girls and one boy. And I tell you this, my mom spent a number of years at AMHI when I was growing up. And I was raised more by my paternal grandparents and some of my paternal aunts.
AS 06:46
AMHI for people who don't know...
TH 06:48
Augusta Mental Health Institute, the old stone building that's on the east side of the river.
AS 06:53
That the state house faces.
TH 06:54
Yes.
AS 06:55
And it was the State House was actually designed to face AMHI, so that legislators would always have those who needed those services in their hearts and minds.
TH 07:07
Absolutely. Well, I visited my mother there a couple of times, it was a miserable experience. Meaning it was hard to understand as a child.
AS 07:18
How old were you?
TH 07:20
The first time I think I was 11... I was 10. But in the middle of my mother's stay there, my father died in an accident. So there were six kids. And anyway, so when I say we were raised by my aunts and my grandpas, I mean it. They weren't just babysitting.
AS 07:40
God Bless them.
TH 07:40
So we anyway, and that was, you know, I think probably, for me what was what I learned the most from that is how incredibly important family is, you know, I love my extended family, my not just my siblings, but my aunts, their children. I mean, think about this, because the impact on them, you know, their life wasn't normal. And it wasn't their parents that, you know, that weren't capable, but now they had cousins that were siblings. So it had a ripple effect, but the family was the safety net and and so now as you know, adults and grandparents, I mean my siblings, you know, grandparents now we're trying to make sure that our children and our grandchildren recognize the same importance and without the trauma you know, how do we cultivate that value system? So it's a big part of it I mean, I consider myself a main or at a cellular level. I've traveled some but I nothing's makes me feel better than driving over that bridge on the way home. Like I beep the horn right when the middle of it you know, and flying. I love flying into Portland, we can land over the water. I just think it's the beautiful view of the island and downtown.
AS 09:04
And see Bug Light right underneath you.
TH 09:06
Absolutely. It's just gorgeous. And who wouldn't want to live here? So I you know, we lived in Greater Portland, Portland, South Portland growing up and and I went to college in Brunswick and I, you know, I've worked for so many years. I've heard people say, Oh, we have such a brain drain. You know, all this markets wave. And I look around and I think Well, what does that say about the rest of us?
AS 09:31
I'm the opposite. I really am. I was born and raised in New York City, in Greenwich Village. I went to college in Massachusetts at Smith College, came to Maine for law school, Maine law, Portland and never left. And I've had my whole career here.
TH 09:44
See how smart you are.
AS 09:45
I got here as fast as I could to steal a line from the fabulous Vaughn Stinson if you remember him, the former head of Maine tourism. He was always so funny in speeches because he had the southern accent. And Maine tourism, he'd say, I got here as fast as I could. So I was like, Vaughn, I'm gonna steal that from you and I have. So tell me about when you first came to Augusta and started dealing with Augusta and Augusta politics and all of that, because I feel like that's when we first met. It's been a while. I feel like we met in '07. It was something like that.
TH 10:16
I ran for the legislature in '04, came in second to a nice man from Paris. And then we both ran again. And I came in first in 2006. But I had for my first introduction, I was a social studies teacher.
AS 10:33
High School?
TH 10:35
Junior High. Well, we didn't have Middle School, then that's how old I am. It was junior high. And my first teaching job was in Oakland, at Williams Junior High School. Okay, then I then I moved up to Messalonskee for a couple years, and then I went into adult ed and I didn't go back to the classroom. But when I was, when I was a social studies teacher in the junior high, I gave my kids extra credit for going to the town meeting. We had more eighth graders there than there were voters. I had to teach them about, I mean this is really, you know, democracy is at its basic level. And I just loved it. When I, once I had kids, I was living in Buckfield, I was on the school board for 13 years. When my daughter, my oldest, the 13th year she was in school, I was on that school board. And the timing was such that the legislature was trying to find ways to save money, and they weren't adequately supporting, you know, holding up their end. This was before the referendum question. But I went up and testified in front of the Appropriations Committee, because I was so frustrated. Everything I read, everything I watched, legislators were patting themselves on the back for not... Well, I would say for not cutting the budget. They didn't do it, they made me do it.
AS 11:56
Who was governor at this time?
TH 11:58
Oh, gosh, at the beginning, it was Jock McKernon. So it's during their budget challenges. You remember, the first state shutdown occurred? During Jock's second term, I think anyway, it was in the 90s. I got off the board in 2004. Okay, so that was my last year. So, you know, I waited I like to go last whenever because then I can tie together the things that I really liked that other people said, you know, by way of adding emphasis and, and you know, all those suits went ahead of me, all the superintendents, and then I just stood up and said, No, you can be happy about this. You're not cutting this budget, but you're making me do it. Okay. And so I just want to make sure you leave here and you know that because it's gonna impact education, you may figure it's not on you. Well, at the end of the day, you got to own some of it, because you're making me do it. And after that, my local rep asked me if you might you ever thought about running? And I said, hell no. And then I went home and thought about it and talk with my husband. I was self employed at the time and ended up saying, well, that looks like it would be interesting. And I did.
AS 13:09
You ran as a Democrat.
TH 13:11
I did.
AS 13:12
And you remain the democrat for....
TH 13:17
For the eight years that I served I was a democrat. I unenrolled after at the end of my last term in 2014.
AS 13:26
And what made you unenroll?
TH 13:31
Well, I found that I had more difficulty with people who were allegedly on the same team than I did with people on the other team. And that came down to feeling like feeling heard. It's fascinating to watch it it you know, I and you see it differently when you're on the inside than you did you know, you can't ever go back to seeing it the way you used to see it. There were some specific things that happened in 2010. At the election 2010 when Paul LePage won for the first time, both parties of legislature were majority Republican. And I was the assistant leader working with Emily Kane who was our leader, the caucus leader in the house at the time. And I witnessed and was party to some things that happened during the next campaign in 2012. That I almost walked away from the whole thing. I was so angry and so frustrated. So I sat in the back of the room and kept my mouth shut and did my piece for you know, constituent services is a big part of the house, and which I really enjoyed and did that, you know, through my last term, but I was in the process of separating myself emotionally from. I just found that I couldn't believe that I continued to voluntarily be on a team where I didn't feel respected or valued. And you know, the only one who can decide if you're in a political party is you, it felt very different from the beginning of my service to the end.
AS 15:13
How so?
TH 15:16
We used to be really competitive during the campaign, my experience, but then once the votes were counted. Governing is a collaborative exercise. Ff you're going to do it well, you know, if only if there's only 68 republicans in the body that 68 people who were elected by Mainers in those districts. They have value, they have opinions, they they ought to be included in the conversation. They can't control the outcome. But we we stopped shifting from competition to collaboration. And we just competed all the time as if we were always campaigning.
AS 15:56
Do you think that social media has something to do with that?
TH 15:58
Sure.
AS 15:59
Do you think that the larger national political landscape has something to do with that?
TH 16:04
Yes.
AS 16:05
Do you think that there's a cure for that? Can we go back to collaborating?
TH 16:10
Here's the challenge. The political parties control all the rules. Okay, so is it possible? Sure. But we have to take responsibility for our politics back and say, Hell no, I don't want to do it that way anymore. The reason I ran for governor is that I don't, I believe that you compete during the campaign. I was a job applicant. I had an 18 month long job interview with 500,000 people. Okay, I was inadequately persuasive. I did not win. I do not regret one minute.
AS 16:44
Would you do it again?
TH 16:45
No, no. I'm more selfish now.
AS 16:48
Okay, you've heard it here on Serra Speaks first. Terry Hayes is not running for governor.
TH 16:52
No, it requires a significant personal sacrifice in time. I learned a lot. I loved doing it. But Maine's next governor should be considerably younger than I am. That is my belief system that... how do you attract young people? You put them in positions of responsibility. And there's a really good headliner right there, who is that young person that that has an interest that's willing to be a leader? And for the better good, as opposed to for personal? I don't know, I can't think of the right word, embellishment or whatever. So my, I think that the way we do our politics can be a conscious choice and should be and it's often not, we spend our time trying to make the other guys look bad. You know, as if the worst thing that could possibly happen would be if you the other party wins, and, and then they win. And, you know, it goes life as we know it. And you look around and you say, Well, really, you know, we survived?
AS 18:00
When it comes to the question of age, don't you think though there's something to be said for true experience?
TH 18:05
Yes.
AS 18:06
And so where's that? I'm fourty-five now.
AS 18:06
And I still feel very inadequately prepared to run, you know, as someone at fourty-five years old for an executive seat such as the governor, right? What's the sweet spot on age for those executive leadership positions do you think? Do you think it's different for women and men? Because it does take women on average a longer time to reach those kind of positions.
TH 18:11
You're so much better kept than I am.
TH 19:27
It does but it shouldn't. I'm 63, just turned 63 last month but I am not that much smarter now than I was when I first... I mean, I understand more about the challenges, but I don't know anything more about the answers because the answers aren't coming from the person that got the most votes, it's coming from the people they put around them. Okay, that's the wisdom. The most important question to ask a candidate for governor who's going to be your chief of staff, and who's going to be in your cabinet. Because if the person running for governor isn't smart enough to know that they're not very smart, they're not nearly as smart as the people that they put around them and who's going to be willing to work with them? That's the benefit. And I don't think that there's an age with that or I think it would be difficult I think it was difficult for example for Paul, you know, to figure out how to work with the legislature if you haven't had some exposure.
AS 19:37
Paul LePage?
TH 19:37
Paul LePage and you know, with that branch, I think he... Well, he clearly found it very frustrating at times, just from his own comments.
AS 19:46
And for those who don't know, and who are listening from out of state, Paul LePage was a republican governor, that was reelected for a second term and served eight years.
TH 19:56
Correct. So and I served in the legislature for four years on Former Governor Baldacci who was a democrat and for four years under Paul LePage.
AS 20:03
Was there a difference when the democrats and the republicans were in charge as far as your experience is concerned, especially when you became unenrolled? Or were they both their own special..?
TH 20:19
I unenrolled at the end of my legislative service and ran for State Treasurer as an independent as well really is a non enrolled individual, and we don't have an independent category in Maine. But unaffiliated, unenrolled and neither party and was only successful because of my legislative service. The legislature elects the state treasurer in Maine, and at that time, there was a Democratic incumbent and a democratic majority. But but the Republicans had enough votes. And I had enough relationships with Democrats that I could win, and did even though I think it surprised everybody, but me because I can count. I knew that, you know, it's kind of scary when you look at the constitution and you realize, you can become state treasurer, and the only qualifications are 94 votes coming out of the house in the Senate. That's it. You don't have to know anything about money. You don't have to know anything about managing it. It's there's no other qualifications. So I was qualified. You know, I say it that way but I learned a lot. I was on a committee of oversight that oversees Treasury when I was in the legislature, and it was an opportunity to continue my service to the state and the people of state of Maine. And I felt I had value to add, even though I was not. I was termed out Maine has, you know, term limits in our legislative service. And I my was done, because I came up against the term limit.
TH 21:24
So was there a difference in serving two parties? And when I say that, I guess what I mean, is, was there a difference as a legislator, having served terms under the Democrats, and then subsequently terms, a chairman to the Republicans, as far as how the process went? How you felt people were hurt? Or do you think the process withstood, the legislative process withstood the management by both parties? Or not to say who was better or who was worse? But was there a time in which things worked for the people better?
TH 22:38
I would say yes, that well. Some leaders are leaders because they were elected, and some people become states people or statesman when they serve. And I think we witnessed some statesman. I thought that Kevin Raye and Mike Thibodeau, in particular, Kevin was in the majority. Mike was in the majority and senate as a win. So these were two gentlemen who served as successively as presidents of the Senate. And I would say in my dealings with them, I felt that there was a difference that there I was in the other party, I was in leadership for a portion of that time. And I would say I felt differently, which is, which is part of what's odd if I was serving as a Democrat, but I didn't feel the same respect to a relationship necessarily with leadership in the Democratic Party. That's why it's part of what I say you look back and you think, Well, wait a minute. What is this about? Our politics don't have to agree for us to have a strong working relationship and to demonstrate respect. You know.
AS 23:57
Interestingly about both Kevin Raye and Mike Thibodeau. They're both small business owners. Yes. Kevin Raye, makes mustard, mean mustard, lots of flavors. Several are in my refrigerators. It's an ongoing theme of my house. But Mike Thibodeau has a business as well. A shovel business, manufacturing, makes shovels, do you think that being business owners helps in your service to the people of Maine as a legislator? Do you think that that's a good perspective?
TH 24:31
Well, it needs to be part of the mix. But I'm not sure that there's a leg up. I mean, I think that people who made their career in public education bring value to the legislative process, people who, you know, who have been entrepreneurs do, people who served in the military do. I mean, I think there's a...
AS 24:50
The citizen legislature.
TH 24:52
Absolutely. The broader the diversity of the, the better the outcomes if we treat each other with respect And in value. Everybody who is serves in either one of those chambers was put there by the people of Maine. And respecting that and the role that they play, you know, I think we we get we've done, we've become too divided and too much divisiveness too, so that we are competing all the time. And when the collaborating happens, it doesn't get nearly enough play or reward or coverage in the news, so that it has spikes of it went. When you're on the inside, you might feel like it was much more collaborative. You were on that committee. You worked really hard on that bill. You worked on it over two years. You finally and but that story is not told, it's not told by either party. It's not told by the media. So it's so if you go home and you hear the news, and you wonder, wait a minute, I was there for that. That's not how I understood it. That wasn't my experience. I just around that you mentioned, you know, social media, what's getting the buzz, what's being repeated, whose tweet is, you know, raising attention. And oftentimes, it's negative and not the best work that we do.
AS 26:16
Open primaries?
TH 26:18
Absolutely. I'm a taxpayer, I'm paying for that election to happen, I should be able to step up and mark one or the other of those ballots. I don't want someone to tell me well you can if you want to join the party, excuse me, when is your property paid for that? You want to have a closed one just for your party members, you pony up the money, term limits, insult voters. The only people whose choices are limited by term limits is the voter.
AS 26:48
And do you not trust them?
TH 26:49
You know, it's really interesting, if you look back, I was serving in the legislature when we hit the 20 year anniversary. So if you look 20 years before term limits, and 20 years afterwards, you know what the difference was? It really wasn't in the longevity of individuals, it was the leadership. And if you think about what the problem was that got us term limits, it wasn't the rank and file, it was a leadership problem. Think of how long representative Martin served, and the timeframe when we had these conversations about term limits, and that whole piece, that's when we were having them, who is still serving in the Maine legislature?
AS 27:27
John Martin.
TH 27:28
There you go. So, you know, I mean, I just if you just look at the data and say, okay, you know, we often solve the wrong problem.
AS 27:41
Interesting.
TH 27:41
Okay. And I think that...
AS 27:43
And is because the problem is identified because of political will?
TH 27:48
It's distorded, part of it. It's who is the enemy? It's that whole sense, you know, and because the parties make the rules, you know, why don't we have open primaries? Because the parties don't want them. And, and there are many more Democrats and Republicans serving in the legislature that make the rules, then there are people who are not enrolled. So it's a threat. If you think about it, economically. Have you ever read any Catherine Gail's stuff?
AS 27:55
I have not.
TH 28:04
I'm going to send you a link. Catherine Gail is a businesswoman, I want to say from Wisconsin, and if you Google her, she has a TED talk or TEDx talk. And she has a couple of things that she's written, that are about what we need to do in order to take our basically our government back and and stop this, you know, well, it's every minute of every day competition. Because getting outcomes, ou know, winning is winning is about winning elections. It's not about winning on the policy level, because things never change. They don't have to do anything. They just have to stay relatively even in the party's in a way. So I'm, again, Catherine is one of those folks has really thought about this. She did her first thing I read she did with Mike Porter, who is a business professor at Harvard, on the economics of political, the divisiveness and how it plays to the perpetuation of the part of the two party system without having to generate any outcomes that the rest of us are paying for.
AS 29:25
So you're talking about kind of this concept of collaboration over competition.
TH 29:31
Well, it competition during the election, there's no question about it, but it has a place. Once the votes are counted. You got a job to do. It doesn't say you go beat up on the other guy to go get the work done.
AS 29:41
In interviewing women collaboration and compassion and understanding of a colleague or an opposing party or anyone in your sphere is a common theme that's come up when I interview women in business. Tell me why you think that's something that women bring up. Why is that a common thread based on your experience?
TH 30:09
Well, it might well be that more often than not, our voices aren't heard, that we're part of that of that silent, we're not terribly silent. But I an assumption that, that if you lead I will follow, as opposed to wait a minute. Well maybe we see leadership differently, which is why listening, you know, listening is a lost art. You can't collaborate with someone, and you can't even invite them to collaborate unless you're willing to listen to them. And oftentimes, in our politics, we're not paying attention unless we're the ones talking. And I think women get that. I don't know. It's not that no men do. But there are more times in my experience, my life experience, when I felt like I had to take extra effort in order to be heard, which may make me more sensitive to those others who have difficulty being heard, and not wanting to marginalize them, not wanting to leave anybody out. Everybody has a value proposition. It's just a matter of helping them find a place where it fits good, you know, and if they if you're elected, you have the trust of those people who voted for you, and you bring something of value to the table. Let's figure out what it is. You know, I don't. The other thing is it takes away the responsibility of knowing all the answers. I know very few answers. I know a lot of questions, right? But I don't know the answers.
AS 31:48
Note how I'm sitting here asking questions.
TH 31:49
Yeah. But there isn't...There isn't one right answer for most things, you know, it depends is the start of the sentence. And then you look at the variables. So there's a value. I learned in the legislature, working on civility, the whole end with the National Institute for civil discourse, that probably what I need most to understand with my colleagues, is what's their political journey consisted of? Where did their beliefs come from? What experiences inform their perspective, and their politics? And those are conversations we never had. Leadership didn't encourage them. And I, I desperately wanted to have those conversations in the legislature. You know, I remember saying to the caucus, when I was the assistant leader of the conservative group, the Maine Heritige Policy Center, invited the whole legislature to dinner. And we were going to they want to talk about education and their conservative think tank. And I said, Well, hell are you going to buy dinner? I'll go and listen, you know. I wanted to understand why some of my Republican colleagues had, where their belief system came from. So at caucus, I said, I think we should go and I had four or five people just say, that's the anomaly that just gives them, you know, credit, because you're there and I said, you can't even be in the conversation if you're not in the room. I said, you know, education and funding, it was a big challenge at the time. What's the harm in listening? You don't have to agree with anything, you know, but but why wouldn't.. and it ended up 11 of us went. That's, you know, and there was an opportunity to ask them questions, perfectly respectful, totally, you know, nothing, nothing that was confrontational about it. And it's a way to try to change the conversation. If you say, hell no, I won't go in and you stay within how does that help? You know? So I think that showing up, listening, trying to understand where somebody whose perspective is very different, where did it come from, may mean that we can find a different solution, one that neither one of us anticipated to start with, but ends up getting us where we both need to be, you know. When we go into it saying I know the answer, we're probably wrong.
AS 32:16
Two last questions.
TH 34:19
Okay.
AS 34:21
How has the opportunity, how have opportunities for women changed in the sphere in which you've worked over the course of your career?
TH 34:34
My father, who died when I was 11. Prior to his death would be he would say he'd sit us on his on his lap when we got our report card. We go over every grade. And he'd say you can be anything you want to be when you grow up. You just want to be darn good at okay. And he believed that. He had five daughters. I don't know why. You know, I And the two youngest, my brother and my youngest sister weren't even old enough to be in school when he passed away. So they didn't get to hear that. But that was something that you know from and you have to be smart so you can go to college. My dad had a GED that he got in the Navy, and my mother was an RN but before you needed to have a four year degree to be an RN. So I grew up thinking I got to go to college, I had no idea how I was going to pay for we didn't have any money. But what's different, I never felt like I was overlooked, because, but I had to help some of my male counterparts learn how to work side by side with a woman. And my hope is that my daughter, and her generation will benefit from that work that some of us have done. So that they're, they don't have to do it themselves. In other words, that I would hope that we've helped pave some of that. But I can't say that. I can't think of a time. Someone might have thought, Well, you can't do that you're a woman, but you know, didn't stop me. I didn't feel like I can't point to a circumstance when someone said no. I mean, I was a softball umpire. I used to call mens league games when I was a teacher, as my beer money in the summer, you know, because I didn't want to have to work in the summer. So if you just called, you know, balls and strikes for a couple hours in the evening, yeah, you could go down to Reid State Park for the day and buy a couple beers on the way home.
AS 36:34
And you're still calling balls and strikes. You're still the umpire.
TH 36:37
Yeah.
AS 36:38
So last question. I always ask everyone this, it fascinates me. What do you consume? Music, television, your reading materials? Anything from pop culture, favorite authors, your news sources? What do you consume?
TH 36:54
I generally avoid the news because I don't feel that it improves my life in any way. My husband taught me that I don't have to, of course, when you're running for governor, you have to do this. But there's some freedom when you're not. So if I'm looking for news, I will go to Maine Public Radio. I will look at the headlines pretty much every day for the PPH and the Bangor Daily, but don't necessarily read a lot of it. Just in case someone says Hey, did you see but you know. I have a rule. If I'm reading during the work day, I must be learning something. And if I'm not reading during the work day, it's got to be brain fluff. And brain fluff comes in lots of sizes, but it can be historical novels, romance novels, sometimes. A Kindle unlimited subscription or an Audible subscription. I'm more of a reader. If my husband is not home for a week, I probably won't turn the TV on. I might to see the weather forecast but that would be it. Other than that, I don't. I'm not a media consumer that way. And if you were to get in my car and push the radio buttons, there's one for NPR. There's one for George and Rec., 101.3. And there's one for 96.5, which I think is a sports radio that my husband programmed in, which I think is where the Red Sox are. But there you go. So other than that, I'm generally listening to a book off my phone when I'm in the car with my bluetooth.
AS 38:26
So Terry Hayes, thank you so much.
TH 38:36
This was fun.
AS 38:36
This was fun. It's so great to sit with you and take the time to chat. So thank you so much.
TH 38:41
My pleasure.
AS 38:42
Thank you to everyone listening for joining us for this episode of Serra Speaks.
AS 38:52
Thank you for joining us for this episode of Serra Speaks where we talk with women about business and not about women in business. Please be sure to hit subscribe and stay tuned for upcoming episodes.